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Animating Faces. Using Papagayo

Discussion in 'Sequencers & Software Tools' started by BundyRoy, Aug 28, 2014.

  1. BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    I've got 3 songs done now for Christmas so I thought I would have a crack at animating a face using papagayo. I've had a look at the program and I just want to make sure I have the process correct.

    The papagayo program itself is used to determine the timings of the different phonemes and it exports as a .dat file. I think I can do this after watching Bobo's videos

    Then I use Bobo's Papagayo to LOR software to assign channels to the phonemes and import it into LOR as a clipboard.

    I gather there are a few tricks like ensuring you use 25 FPS and when working with RGB I need to create a track with groups for each of the Phonemes.

    Is this the whole process or is this now redundant and a new way has been invented. I see on Bobo's website and videos that he uses version 1.3.5.3 but when I did a google search I see Papagayo is up to version 2. Should I use the latest version or 1.3.5.3.

    I also saw on Bobo's webpage a link to Sean's papagayo. What is the difference? I gather that Sean is in the process of incorporating this into xlights. This has not been been released yet has it.

    Any tips people have on animating faces will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
     
  2. OP
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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    I'm not sure how I started this thread in community projects. I meant to start it in Aussie LOR - General discussions. Feel free to move it to another section that is better suited. I tried to remove it and restart it but it wouldn't let me. Thanks.
     
  3. Superman

    Superman I Have C.L.A.P and its very infectious Global Moderator

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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    Thanks Superman.
     
  5. Superman

    Superman I Have C.L.A.P and its very infectious Global Moderator

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    All in a Days work mate.

    You may want to check out a thread that Sean from Nutcracker did which explains a bit about Papagyo and the plans for it to be put into xLights/Nutcracker.
    I can see it in the new releases of xlight but I don't personally have a need for it and therefore haven't checked it out.
    I think you will find that the big difference between Bob's and Sean's will be that one is basically designed for LOR and the other will export to most software thru xlights.

    http://auschristmaslighting.com/forums/index.php?topic=5603.0
     
  6. davrus

    davrus Silent Elf

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    This has been imported into Vixen 3, and is now a native effect. Currently in the Dev Build, and will be in the 3.1.0 release which is due "real soon now".
     
  7. OP
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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    Thanks Davrus. I plan on looking at other sequencers next year but will stick with LOR this year. Got to get my moneys worth out of it for starters!

    Had a little more investigation into papagayo. Version 2, is a beta version of a re-write. Downloaded it and it doesn't seem to allow multiple voices so I went back to version 1.3.5.3 as I needed two voices. Seans papagayo on itsmebobo's page seems to be just a self installing version of the link Bob has to papagayo version 1.3.5.3.

    I have now done the papagayo part of the skit I'm using (the kids recorded it). Habbosrus, kindly said he didn't mind if I kind of copied his face animation sequence. Hopefully 650km is far enough apart that not too many people will see both our shows.

    Now tomorrow just need to work through getting it into LOR. Fingers crossed.
     
  8. ebrady

    ebrady New Elf

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    I have used Papagayo extensively in the past. While it does allow you to accomplish the task, it is extremely temperamental and buggy and it can cost a lot of time working around these problems. Version 1.2 is the older version and has the most bugs, version 1.3.5.3 is newer and has had some of the bugs addressed, but still has some. I have viewed Bobs tutorials, and he explains the process really well. I remember downloading version 2 a while ago and it wouldn't even run on my machine. If your are not familiar with any other sequencers, using the process laid out by Bob would likely be the route that would take the least amount of time. If you are familiar with other sequencers, then you have some other options.


    A number of sequencers have added Animation support natively in the last year. (One of which I had something to do with! :D )


    Vixen3 has implemented most of the features of Papagayo natively, including the Lyric converter, and allows you to import work previously performed in Papagayo. If you sequence using Vixen3, your work can be exported into Comma delimited or Falcon Pi Player format. Presently, xLights will NOT allow you to convert either format to LOR but Sean has indicated interest in picking up support for this format. I can work with him, if needed, to pick up this support. You would then use xLights to covert the work back to LOR or whatever format you want.
    Here are some tutorials I wrote up for the new Vixen3 functionality...
    http://doityourselfchristmas.com/forums/showthread.php?32901-Vixen-3-Lip-Sync-Overview&p=328079#post328079


    xLights now allows you to do facial animations, I have not used this specifically, but Sean has some great tutorial videos out there. Search the forums and you will find them. You should be able to animate there and then export to LOR format.


    HLS has also picked up support for facial animation and can do Lyric conversions. I have used it, and it is not a bad way to go if you are familiar with how to use HLS. Same thing, you could do the work there and then export.


    Any of these sequencers will require you to overcome a learning curve. If you decide to us papagayo this year, remember to hold on to your native .pgo files so you can convert to the new sequencer in the future.


    Ed



     
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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    Thanks for the reply Ed. The only sequencers I have used so far is LOR and xlights. I have also used some of Bob's programs. This will be enough for me this year so it looks like papagayo it is. I figure if I try and learn too many of them at once I won't remember any of them. The other side of it is there is only so many video tutorials I can watch without going crazy. I really appreciate them and couldn't do it without them but sometimes they get you get frustrated having to watch so many. Maybe I am just a slow learner.

    Anyway, thanks for the feedback. I look forward to giving some of the other sequencing options a crack later on. Some of the things people can do on some of them blows my mind.
     
  10. OP
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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    Found one of those bugs you mentioned Ed. I changed the FPS to 25 to suit Bobs software. Then I did all the work and saved it. Once I reopened the file later on the FPS was 20. Not good. I then found out you have to click on the 25 FPS tab twice to make it change to 25. Lesson learnt. It is now 25FPS and I have to redo it all (you know you have changed it to 25FPS when the numbers on the frames go up in multiples of 25 not 20).

    One other thing I had trouble with was editing the .pgo file. In my original work I had allocated some words to the wrong voice. I remembered that Sean had said in his tutorial that the .pgo file was a text file and you could change things in there. I thought beauty, I'll just change it in there from one voice to the other and that will stop me from having to do the whole lot again.

    I opened the .pgo file in wordpad (after creating a backup of the original). Moved all the required voice commands from one voice to the other. Then changed the list of lyrics at the top of each voice section (|bits between the lines|), then changed the number of lyrics (eg 14) at the top each voice section and resaved the file.

    When I tried to reopen the file in papagayo it wouldn't open. Nothing happens, no messages. Is there something I missed or should I use a different editor. When I closed papagayo down it said to look in papagayo.exe.log for the error but I can't find that file.

    Anyway as it turns out I had to change the FPS anyway and that required me to hit the breakdown option, so I've done it all again in the meantime anyway. I was just interested in case I need to edit it again.

    Thanks
     
  11. OP
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    BundyRoy

    BundyRoy Senior Elf

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    Just in case anyone else is as dumb as me. If you're having trouble finding how to export the .dat file from papagayo you need to switch back from the xsheet tab to the breakdown tab and use the export voices button found there. Spent ages looking through the web before I discovered that. I new it had to be simple because no one else was posting about having issues with it. Just me!
     

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