WS2815 Extending Data and Backup Wires

[addj20]

Hi All
I'm starting down the rabbit hole of trying to install mostly permanent LED strip lighting around our roof line for Christmas and other holidays..we like having lights up for Christmas, but I detest putting them up and taking them down! Want to make that part easier.

I have ordered a heap of WS2815 12V strips (actually BTF2815, but I think they are basically interchangeable) and a few Digi Quads for control, and am now looking at cables and connectors.

I'm planning to use 3 core AWG 18 from LightUpLEDs as much as possible, maybe with some 15A extension lead instead for some of the longer runs, with either Ray Wu/XConnect or SP16 connectors depending on the situation.

My question is about wiring up the backup data wire on the 2815s...
I understand I can use 3 core to the start of the strip and connect the Backup In to Ground at the beginning?
At some points I will have about 2 metres between the end of one strip and the beginning of the next. How should I make the connections between these strips? I obviously can't short the BI to Ground again at the beginning of the second strip, but can I connect Data Out of the first strip to both Data In and Backup In of the second strip (and therefore use the 3 core as the interconnect), or do I need use 4 core between the strips and keep all the wires/signals seperate?

If I need to use 4 core, does anyone have a suggestion of where to source a suitable 4 core cable?

Cheers

 

[darylc]

you can leave backup In unconnected at the start of the string, and also any other point along the string if you prefer.

 

[addj20]

Ahh ok, I was wondering that. So you're saying if I don't connect Backup In at the start of the second strip, it will "fix" itself (as it was designed) when the data signal gets to the second LED?

In that case, do I even need to bother shorting the Backup In to Ground at the start of the first strip? Will it not self-repair also?

 

[AussiePhil]

Hi All
I'm starting down the rabbit hole of trying to install mostly permanent LED strip lighting around our roof line for Christmas and other holidays..we like having lights up for Christmas, but I detest putting them up and taking them down! Want to make that part easier.

Just keep in mind UV for permanent style inputs.

I have ordered a heap of WS2815 12V strips (actually BTF2815, but I think they are basically interchangeable) and a few Digi Quads for control, and am now looking at cables and connectors.

I'm planning to use 3 core AWG 18 from LightUpLEDs as much as possible, maybe with some 15A extension lead instead for some of the longer runs, with either Ray Wu/XConnect or SP16 connectors depending on the situation.

I would use 4 wire interconnects from one strip to the next and take the opportunity to power inject at the start of each string or after longer breaks like the couple meters you mention... If you subscribe to the cut the positive wires you could use 3 wire to extend D0/D1/Gnd
some companies call them D0/D1 some D0/B1

My question is about wiring up the backup data wire on the 2815s...
I understand I can use 3 core to the start of the strip and connect the Backup In to Ground at the beginning?

It is better to ground the backup data line at the start were it comes from the controller.... in all other cases extend D0/D1. you can leave it floating as Daryl says but at the risk of noise causing issues.

At some points I will have about 2 metres between the end of one strip and the beginning of the next. How should I make the connections between these strips? I obviously can't short the BI to Ground again at the beginning of the second strip, but can I connect Data Out of the first strip to both Data In and Backup In of the second strip (and therefore use the 3 core as the interconnect), or do I need use 4 core between the strips and keep all the wires/signals seperate?

as above extend the two data wires always, why would you want to loss the benefit of redundancy between strips.

If I need to use 4 core, does anyone have a suggestion of where to source a suitable 4 core cable?

Treat you Power/Gnd as seperate to your D0/D1/Gnd as far as wire is concerned, just ensure Gnd is continuous.

Cheers

 

[addj20]

Just keep in mind UV for permanent style inputs.

Yeah, I'm definately concerned about that. The diffuser channels I've ordered are supposedly "Anti-UV Sun Protection"

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I don't necessarily trust that though, so my plan is to make the strips semi-permanent. I'll make them so they can be removed if neccessary, and I'll keep an eye on them as far as the diffusers getting brittle, and yellowing of the strips. The hardest part of making them removeable is finding somewhere to store them when they're down!

I would use 4 wire interconnects from one strip to the next and take the opportunity to power inject at the start of each string or after longer breaks like the couple meters you mention... If you subscribe to the cut the positive wires you could use 3 wire to extend D0/D1/Gnd
some companies call them D0/D1 some D0/B1

That's a good idea about splitting the positive which I hadn't thought of, so thanks for that.
The longest run of "unbroken" strip I'm planning on having is about 7.5m, so I'm hoping to get away with Power Injection at each end only.
Other Power Injection is going to be via a Ray-Wu T-piece with a seperate PI cable run, so splitting the positive should be easy enough.

It is better to ground the backup data line at the start were it comes from the controller.... in all other cases extend D0/D1. you can leave it floating as Daryl says but at the risk of noise causing issues.

as above extend the two data wires always, why would you want to loss the benefit of redundancy between strips.

Treat you Power/Gnd as seperate to your D0/D1/Gnd as far as wire is concerned, just ensure Gnd is continuous.

Awesome info, thanks heaps for your help.
Now I'm off to re-plan my wiring!

 

[AussiePhil]

Yeah, I'm definately concerned about that. The diffuser channels I've ordered are supposedly "Anti-UV Sun Protection"

Page Not Found - Aliexpress.com

I don't necessarily trust that though, so my plan is to make the strips semi-permanent. I'll make them so they can be removed if neccessary, and I'll keep an eye on them as far as the diffusers getting brittle, and yellowing of the strips. The hardest part of making them removeable is finding somewhere to store them when they're down!

That's a good idea about splitting the positive which I hadn't thought of, so thanks for that.

Personally I don't support or see the need to split/break the positive wire as you end up loosing the benefits of feeding the power in both directions, If your "injecting" via the T's then don't bother to worry about it.
Pity you already have the 2815 strip, the GS8208 is the same redundant data setup 2811 protocol but with far better power use overall.

The longest run of "unbroken" strip I'm planning on having is about 7.5m, so I'm hoping to get away with Power Injection at each end only.

yep each end makes sense for 7.5M of strip

Other Power Injection is going to be via a Ray-Wu T-piece with a seperate PI cable run, so splitting the positive should be easy enough.

Awesome info, thanks heaps for your help.
Now I'm off to re-plan my wiring!

Cheers
Phil

 

[fugley]

sorry skim read most
after years of trying to find that just right diffiuer for LEDs the above really just dont cut it
try "PEF Rod" it cheap easy to work with and just works
comes in just about any size up to 40mm so could also be used for jumping archers if surported

 

[addj20]

Personally I don't support or see the need to split/break the positive wire as you end up loosing the benefits of feeding the power in both directions, If your "injecting" via the T's then don't bother to worry about it.
Pity you already have the 2815 strip, the GS8208 is the same redundant data setup 2811 protocol but with far better power use overall.

yep each end makes sense for 7.5M of strip

Cheers
Phil

Yeah, I hear you. I think I've come up with a plan where I can avoid the need for the 4 core extension...it'll use another channel on the controller, but I've got a few spare anyway. The problem is I can't find a local supplier for a 4 pin tee Ray Wu pigtail...I guess I'll have to make up my own.

fugley, that's a great suggestion for the PEF rod...I know the stuff you mean. I'll certainly give that a try. I think that should do ok with UV too?

 

[fugley]

to be fair dont think its designed to be left in the sun ?
had it up for a little over three years under a patio roof which will see the sun fully on it when the roofs open and to date it appears as new

No.1 thing that worked like a dream is 6mm perspex ... price is a killer tho

pictures are prett crappy taken years ago when playing around with the idea of diffusion
6mm thick / 80mm wide perspex sanded both sides
with standard LED strip set back 50mm away from the perspex so the light disperses through the perspex

 

[addj20]

to be fair dont think its designed to be left in the sun ?
had it up for a little over three years under a patio roof which will see the sun fully on it when the roofs open and to date it appears as new

It's cheap enough that I think I'll just try it and see what happens....YOLO!

 

[AussiePhil]

Yeah, I hear you. I think I've come up with a plan where I can avoid the need for the 4 core extension...it'll use another channel on the controller, but I've got a few spare anyway. The problem is I can't find a local supplier for a 4 pin tee Ray Wu pigtail...I guess I'll have to make up my own.

fugley, that's a great suggestion for the PEF rod...I know the stuff you mean. I'll certainly give that a try. I think that should do ok with UV too?

Generally the 4 core was common when we all used 2801 pixels... i personally have lots still... if redundant strings such as 2815 and 8208 get used more we may get them locally at some point.

 

[addj20]

I've ordered 25 4 pin Ray Wu pigtails from Hanson....all they had in stock...so I'll try to make do with that for the moment. I'll probably just make a few connections permanent that I was planning to have removeable, and add a few power injection wires into the pigtails rather than using the Tees.

I'm struggling to even find the 3 core wire in stock anywhere, so I might just end up using extension cables, and some double runs of the Bunnings garden lighting 2-core where I need a 4 core.

 

[jonno76]

sorry skim read most
after years of trying to find that just right diffiuer for LEDs the above really just dont cut it
try "PEF Rod" it cheap easy to work with and just works
comes in just about any size up to 40mm so could also be used for jumping archers if surported

Just came across your post @fugley. This stuff is pretty damn good! Not sure where you are, but i found it as gap filler rod. Just running some tests with it. I was concerned about possible heat with it being so close to the actual leds, but no issues. You had any issues your end?

Cheers.

Jonno.